I finished up my third week of the 30-30-30 protocol as of 9-7-18. I'm going until 9-14-18 which will be a 30 day experiment . This is just my opinion and experience so if science doesn't agree there's nothing I can do. I just know what I see and experience. I was going to wait for the full 30 days to give my insights but it has been my experience that my body adjusts and adapts within 2-3 weeks. Especially when I'm doing the same thing everytime I train. Also because of measurements and weight I've seen enough changes to be able to comment.
None of this is to discredit anyone's results they may have had. I think age, genetics, and years of training has alot to do with putting on size. I'm at a point where I don't believe my body is going to change much if at all. When it comes to isometrics I seem to get the same results. Differant protocols may put more emphasis either on strength, weight loss, or loss of waist size.
I originally did this experiment to see if this protocol could put on size as claimed by others. I lost size on my arms(1/2"), my waist(1/4"), and my calves(1/2"). Funny thing is I gained a half inch around my neck. I would probably say the reason for this is because I have never done long holds for my neck so that's how my body adapted to it. I intentionally tried to gain weight which is hard when You work in the hot sun all day 6 days a week. LOL, I gained 4 lbs so not much of a difference. Plus isometrics for me tend to make it hard to keep weight on. So I would say for myself this protocol did not put on any size.
Now my insights on the one position isometrics. Alot of times I'll use tree work as my monitor on how I feel about an exercise protocol. This protocol did help me feel strong and I feel I didn't lose any strength. But what I noticed is when doing tree work I got pretty sore from the work. I actually have been doing easier jobs than usual. I was not getting sore before I started this experiment when I was doing calisthenics, cables, self resistance and light DBs. Also when I did 3 point isometrics or self resistance I never got sore from tree work. Of course if You're doing this protocol it would take forever and burn You out if You tried it with 3 point isometrics. Anyway, not being sore from work is an important thing to me.
I think the 30-30-30 protocol is a great way to exercise. But I don't want to say everyone won't gain size because I believe this depends on certain factors. For me if I was to stay with this I would try differant positions throughout the week.
MichaelS: What is your opinion so far about the 30/30/30 second Isometric hold?
MichaelS: I think experts do not realize that Isometrics can be 30 seconds long, and for me it includes movement. As a teen did Isometrics, Dynaflex, Isometric Exerciser and Pushups, Situps and Leg lifts daily . PS: I did the Little Italy version of the Atlas Course daily, exercises and stretching exercises.
Michael,
Sorry, I was insufficiently clear. I have meant that one holding 10+10+10 sec is 1 rep for me. Three reps are 3 holdings. They give good pumping if the rest interval <30 sec. Other people consider one holding as one set.
What?
According to my experience, multi-set (3 and more) isometrics my add very good pumping even for 10-10-10 sec holding, especially if it is performed as a supplement after dynamic self-resistance training.
MichaelS I think you are right, Isometrics no pump, and moving Isometric Weightlifting/VRT a pump. But Isometrics make you hard, VRT increased muscle size and hard.
I was thinking about some of the guys in High School & College, most guy's using Isometric Weightlifting/VRT used 1 rep, 8 to 10 seconds, some used 3 reps, some used 5 to 15 reps and yes some bulked. I think it is how we use it.
For gaining muscles, I do not see a big difference between long isometric holding and slow dynamic self-resistance performance if we do not relax our muscles during reps and sets. That is our muscles during sets are continuously under high tension to restrict a blood flow in the muscles like in isometrics. In this case, our movements are slow and smooth with conscious keeping muscles under high tension. Time under tension will be ~ the same as for 30+ sec max isometric holding. If mind concentration is good, our "stato-dynamic" tension (~90% of max) will be close to tension for long isometric holding (hard as we dare). In both cases, we have prolonged time under high tension and blood restriction in the muscles that stimulate muscle hypertrophy.
Was talking to that weightlifter friend with the Gym in his house for his sons and him to use; he has a bad shoulder, and has known about Isometric Weightlifting for 30 years! It is his observation that adding bulk is the same for both. I respectfully disagreed, but that was his observation.
MichaelS I agree more time under tension sounds good! Nice routine, and now it makes more sense, 30/30/30 might work great while you are doing 3 or 4 reps under tension for each 30. I like using a web belt aka strap for weightlifting exercises.
By the way just in case You're interested the workout probably took 20 minutes if that.
1)Squats
2)Pulldowm
3)Chest Press or Flye
4)Seated Row
5)Press or Lateral Raise
6) Stiff LeggedDeadlift
7)Pullover
8)Bicep Curl
9)Tricep Extension
10)Neck
Hi Michael - I just thought that was a good observation you made.
Mike and Bob, I made a mistake by saying 100%. As he says in his book," Hard as You dare" for the last 30 seconds. I can hold a steady hard contraction for 30 seconds. Bob I would agree with this for most people," I think that 30-30-30 sec protocol is excessive". I would have never been able to do this if I was just beginning isometrics. I have some decent experience with them under my belt. Yeah someone else might want to start off with 5-6-7 or 10-10-10 or 20-20-10.
The protocol is not off. Steve Justas in his book,"Rock,Iron,Steel" talks about all differant kinds of hold times with differant intensities. Guys like Fred Hutch, Silverlooks, and Aaron have done long hold isometrics. The 30-30-30 protocol is not mine. I heard of it through Silverlooks. He got it off of Drew Baye, he got it off of someone else and so on. Nothing is new under the sun.
Also this is not Darden's superslow stuff. Isometrics are without movement. I thought I'd share this with You guys. I learn things off of people that do and share their experiences. Mike You ask about the Solytrain protocol. The one time I pmed with him he said his protocol (5-6-7) was great for general health. He told me if You want to get strong You need more time under tension, via longer holds.
"I was not getting sore before I started this experiment when I was doing calisthenics, cables, self resistance and light DBs. Also when I did 3 point isometrics or self resistance I never got sore from tree work." That first approach was how Tony Sansone based his training and except for the cables is probably close to how the ancient Greeks trained. It is all about creating functional strength and one aspect would be not getting sore from manual labor. Another aspect would be feeling refreshed and energized from a workout. Functional strength is the ability to move your body and other objects through three dimensions without stiffness or pain, and with mobility and fluidity.
MihcaelS: 6 to 10 Exercises using a strap, and in the middle you use the 30/30/30 protocol. I am interested what is your opinion so far? I agree wit Bob50 the 30 seconds at 30%/50% and for 30/30 will will but 70%/100% maximum for 30 seconds sounds off. Bob50 I like the 50%, 75% and 100% for 10 seconds each also.
PS: Michael you know Solytrain's Protocol, and other means, is your new method 30/30/30 better?
Different things work for different folks, the main thing MichaelS is you like it. I thought 30 seconds at max was a 20 seconds to long, but that is me, MichaelS the main is if it works for you! I do not like Ellington Darden's 30/30/30 second protocol, and prefer either regular Isometric Weightlifting/VRT exercises or the 10/5 protocol. I do love Isometric Exercisers and using a web belt for weightlifting exercises and love regular isometrics.
Thank You Bob, I think I'll just keep this stuff to myself from now on.
I am not good in isometrics and have very limited experience. However, I think that 30-30-30 sec protocol is excessive. 50% and 75% of max effort are OK for 30 sec each. But, factually, we cannot keep 100% effort for 30 sec. Muscle tension will gradually decrease to the end of this interval to ~80-90%. I think that the real time of holding with max effort is ~6-10 secs, as was mentioned by old strong men. For strength gaining this time is enough. If we want muscle size, there are more effective dynamic methods. Currently, I prefer 10-10-10 sec protocol with 50-75-100% of max effort as a supplement to dynamic self-resistance exercises. It helps to increase dynamic voluntary tension.
James A. Baley's book has you use 3 reps at different angles with the Belt, the usual for Isometric Exercisers is one rep 8 to 10 seconds at max, while some guys used 3 or more reps in the 1960's. With the Belt many used one max rep, and the results are great.
You can use anything you want with this isometric protocol. You just hold 30 secs at 35-50%, then straight into 75%, then right into 100% intensity. Pick 6-10 exercises and do the protocol in the middle position.
Very interesting MichaelS! I never heard about this method before and sounds like you have been using TSCT and like the results. Sounds like TSCT gives the same results as an Isometric Exerciser and a Steamer Trunk Belt 12' long, (aka Yoga Belt). The Steamer Trunk Belt was very popular in New York and East Coast Cities in the early 1960's (maybe earlier 1950s?); James A. Baley wrote a book on it in 1977 called "Illustrated Guide to Developing Athletic Strength, Power and Agility". I've always loved the Isometric Exercisers (like the Snyder Isometric Exerciser, the Mickey Mantle One Minute a Day Gym and the Strength Builder). Some teen guys in the 1960's used two wooden bars (some used a flat bar for te feet) connected by nylon rope, and Bruce Tegner showed a similar exerciser in his book Isometric Power Exercises (1964) and Isometric Exerciser give great results.
I checked that site thank you.
MichaelS I googled "Drew Baye's 30-30-30" and got nothing, is is like Ellington Darden's 30-30-30 protocol (ie 30 seconds negative, 30 seconds positive and 30 seconds negative using machines; and 20-20-20 for weights using a barbell or dumbbells)?. Is there a link?
I always thought using "isometrics" one builds muscle, yes lean muscle. Genetics plays a large roll in our lives.
I know guys like Aaron( Prowler) and Silverlooks who use to post here have had size gains from isometrics. But I never could gain size, probably because of age, years of training and I've reached my genetic limit. I like to experiment with differant things so I may try to find Aaron's old concepts on here and give them a whirl. But honestly I think people mistake size gain for a better looking body compostion. That's why I measure and weigh myself throughout.
Thanks, Michael, for your great and honest testimony. In general, it confirms my experience that hard dynamic training is more effective than isometrics for gaining/keeping muscle mass. So, for the older people dynamic is more appropriated to fight sarcopenia. Also it gives many other benefits for this age group.