My buddy that was a weightlifter and injured, now uses a 5 foot red oak staff as a barbell and loves Atlas Isometric Weightlifting exercises (AKA VRT) and it is working for him! He is looking great, plus reports his friend is using Isometric Weightlifting (VRT) with "The Action Hero Body" training book by Jorgen De Mey and also doing great. He uses Isometrics for the weightlifting and does the Calisthenics.

" After a certain amount of years of training can we really get any bigger? Can we gain muscular size? Will Our body look any differant? My opinion, I don't think a natural person can build more muscle or get bigger without gaining fat. After so many years of training and being older I believe You probably reached what You're going to be able to do genetically. "

As much as it pains me to admit, this has been my experience as well, at least as far as increasing muscle size goes. That being said, I have also found that losing body fat and increasing muscle tone can have a fairly dramatic effect on improving one's muscular development. At 40 years old, I look more muscular now than I did when I was younger, yet am much smaller in size (and not as cute).

My father is 74 years old and has been working out since he was 14. He recently dropped 20 lbs. (intentionally) and even though he lost over 1/2" on his arms, he looks more muscular.

I'll throw this in. With pictures and videos, camera angles and lighting can give you two different pictures on the same day. Direct sunlight washes out definition and detail. Those two pictures might not show the difference you think.

Healthwise, depending on your age, some bodyfat is neccessary for health. The percentage goes up as you age. Here is a link to a fairly common bodyfat chart https://www.accumeasurefitness.com/body-fat-measurement-charts-for-men-and-women.html Ten percent used to be considered an athletic ideal, but over the decades with the extremes bodybuilding took, everyone wants or thinks they want to get under 10%.

Having said that, I think it is pretty remarkable that Michael moved down from 220 to 165. That is a lot of weight and a lot of body change to have made, even over time. The 185 to 165 weight range for men used to be considered ideal for men 5-8 to 5-11 in height; depending on bone structure. Bodybuilding itself is based on illusion as opposed to actual size. We got away from that with all the mesomorphic mass monsters that came on the scene from the nineteen eighties on. The width of the shoulders, waist/chest differential, the shape of the chest, the way the thigh's are built, the size of the neck, the width of the back etc., can all add or detract from the overall appearance of the body.

Bob that's an extreme example. Honestly I would take the first picture. I think he looks fat in the second picture. I have seen pictures where he's in between these two. Really I think this all depends on each individual. I personally feel better at a lower weight. Right now I weight 165 lbs and I feel pretty darn good. If I go above 175 lbs I feel like crap.

No idea what my bodyfat level is. But I would say 18 percent and above is probably unhealthy. I think eating for heart health, keeping Your cholestrol in a good range, and eating so You don't get diabetes is the most important. Yeah some people like athletes eat extreme diets but it's really not that hard to stay healthy and lean.

A diet with an abundance of vegetables, a couple of servings of fruit a day, lean proteins like eggs, fish, chicken, and turkey, and starches like brown rice, quiona, sweet potatoes, beans, and oatmeal would make it easy for most. I myself have made excuses in the past when I weighed 220lbs at 5'11". If You think You feel good at a higher bodyfat level then go ask Your doctor to do some blood test and see what he says. They have certain blood test, (I think it's called a lipo protein A?), to see how Your arteries are. Don't quote me on the name of the blood test. Also try losing some weight and see how You feel than. I bet You feel better, I know I did.

I agree that moderate fat on our body creates the illusion of increased muscles and makes us just bigger and heavy. But anyway, our body needs some fat to be healthy. Science confirms that "body fat is a highly specialized organ, critically important for health and longevity."

Bob he is older and leaner and imho he is using a very strict, hardcore diet to stay that lean; yes he'd look better with some extra weight.

Should we really look very shredded (muscular?) or we should keep some body fat when we become older? Look at 2 pictures of Steve Maxwell where he is older and shredded, and he is younger and has some fat on his body. From my point of view, on the second picture, he looks more healthy. I believe if Steve would have some fat now (66 years old), he would look almost like at his younger age (45-50). I would choose the second option to look little younger and bigger, but it is only my personal opinion.

There are some old folks in fantastic condition, many methods work, it is continued exercise, watching your diet and positive thinking that works for many. The Atlas Course/Calisthenics, Isometrics, Walking, VRT/Isometric Weight Lifting Exercises, Yoga and Tai Chi; many methods work, it is just finding your way. My Uncle trained Boxers and they wanted a lean, muscular body and Atlas Isometric Weight Lifting and Calisthenics and training worked.

"I do believe differant training types will make Your body look a little differant..." I absolutely agree with you, Michael. We also can compare Atlas with later natural weightlifters.

Possible to " regain" some muscle mass in older people. I agree, to regain what You already had years before if You stopped lifting for sometime. Or if You never lifted before. But You're not going to get any bigger than Your genetics will allow or what You had in Your first 3-5 years of training. And Yes any resistance exercise will give similar results.

I do believe differant training types will make Your body look a little differant after You've been training for a while. Example for me, Isometrics and light dumbells make me more veiny.

This paper is about the possibility to regain some muscle mass in old people. It emphasizes the positive effects of weightlifting, and I see some commercial interest to attract older people to gyms.

https://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/12/02/can-you-regain-muscle-mass-after-age-60/

Factually, any resistance exercises can give the similar results if we work out regularly.

In New York; the Plank and wall-sit type exercises along with Atlas type Courses and Isometrics have long been popular, along with weight lifting and machine exercises. Many mix and match and that helps many. Great thread!

I seen this on the New Push up forum and it's a good blog. I agree with Steve even though I think he's a little wierd.

http://www.maxwellsc.com/blog.cfm?blogid=200

Exactlly Greg, " The fun is continuing to workout, find interesting ways to put exercises together and to fight against the entropy of natural life. LOL - we break down. We also get lazy and distracted in our discipline. But, I'm planning on my life being productive until the end of days."

That's right. We should keep on trucking and having fun with it. I like experimenting with differant things when it comes to exercise. In doing so You find things that work and some that don't work. But there are so many exercises and ways to train no need to force anything.

Good point, Greg. I agree that health, increased internal energy, speed and lightness of movements, joint flexibility, practical strength, and endurance are much more useful for our life than stupid raw power and slow bear muscle mass.

Michael - one thing that stuck out after re-reading your post was that goals change. I don't necessarily want to have bigger muscle size. Muscle size beyond a certain point has a downside in limiting mobility and adding extra weight for the body to carry. Whatever my bodyfat portion is at any given point, this last few years, and it fluctuates between 12 and 15 percent, my body tends to hang on to a bodyweight of 186-188.

At this stage in the game I want to work correcting imbalances from the overtraining of certain movements I've done over the years. In other words I want to work towards a more aesthetic physique as I age. I also want to increase my ability to move, have coordination and have balance. That is why I am spending time on martial arts and ki training again as part of my overall workout strategy. I also still do incline sprints.

I agree with you guys. We should do our best to extend our active life as long as possible.

I'll go with that. I think you can always make changes and improvement in your appearance. I don't think any of us have ever "arrived." Being stricter on diet definitely helps; albeit I've seen some very muscular people eat like garbage bins. Ultimately you have a limit to size and strength as dictated by genetics. The fun is continuing to workout, find interesting ways to put exercises together and to fight against the entropy of natural life. LOL - we break down. We also get lazy and distracted in our discipline. But, I'm planning on my life being productive until the end of days.

I know I harp on this a lot, but that is the beauty of the underlying philosophy of the Atlas course. It wasn't about being the ultimate athlete; it was being about the best you can be to thrive in daily living.